#79 Aron Samuels – Transcript

Louis van der Merwe
Welcome to another episode of ensemble advice South Africa. Tonight I have with me in the studio, Aron Samuels. Aron is someone that you might have seen on Instagram. He is someone that is very comfortable behind the camera and has a way of explaining things in a really nice way. Aron, it’s a privilege to have you with me tonight.

Aron Samuels
Thanks, Louie. Yeah, I am. I’ve learned to become comfortable in front of the camera, though it wasn’t always the case. By TR, sometimes you need to push yourself in a bit of a direction. And then I’d look back after that. So yeah, I mean, in front of the camera once again, and what a proficient to actually push yourself a little bit. A like this is really something where I feel like there’s a push and pull from different directions just to just to actually stay alive, especially those those beginning years, give us a little bit of a of an introduction of who Aron is and how he got into financial services world. Yeah, so if I, if I start in the, in the early days, I grew up in a small town. I actually read a headline this often and funny enough that atashi, the town are the cleanest in Africa, or in the top 10 or something that is outside places. So that’s that’s where I grew up. And most of my schooling, they finished up high school in Stellenbosch, my family relocated, and then I started my studies. So I had a keen interest in law at the time. So I studied a become law. And through that I was exposed to financial planning really, for the first time, I think at that stage one’s perception is that financial planning refers to some insurance policies and maybe an investment or some pension thing on the side. And once you start being exposed to it, academically at least, that’s to the bag. But me so yeah, when after I finished my, my undergrad, I entered the industry as intern, interning as a financial planner within the practice. So, yeah,

Louis van der Merwe
what did that exposure look like? You know, when you say you’ve been exposed to it, like, how does someone studying law, end up with financial services. That’s, that’s, I mean, I can see the connections. But I’d love to hear how that actually happened.

Aron Samuels
There as I was actually telling a colleague, the story the other day, when when I was a student, obviously having no exposure to the industry, and only knowing what I’ve read, on paper, I told myself, I probably want to be a compliance officer. And since that would have firmly ended in tears for everyone involved, because I told myself that it would be the perfect cross section between law and financial services and on paper that just seems like the right fit. But it’s possibly the most wrong foot for me that, that you’ll be able to find. But it just shows you don’t for when you’re a student in our school, you don’t actually know until until you get into it. And so I actually added investments and financial planning as elective modules during my undergrad studies and that we are started, do you know that Sega was exposed to that and that caught my interest? The Lord, they are so so loved and low and the way that it taught me to sink and do to look at things but the I definitely started to gravitate towards financial side of things.

Louis van der Merwe
That’s so interesting, because when I think of someone studying law, they end up typically with insurance companies as legal advisors, and I would explain to you the intricacies of you know, the estate plan and what impact this has, but yet you found yourself in a practice, how much did you rely on your your training, specifically within the South African law context during your early years

Aron Samuels
during the first yo yo to and I was really very much a newbie. That’s an even part of some of the introductory work I did. So maybe just a bit of context around that was actually even amazing opportunities through the Sisa Academy. And they have a program which they run to into more younger and advisors of color into the market and they link up with some of the top practices all over the country. Now that was actually part of the first group on which they ran in 2016. If I’m not mistaken, and even through the introductory work I did with them at the academy, you’ll realize how much legislation actually underpins what we do everything regarding financial services on the product level that these finds its founder foundation in in legislation and RAs and RA because legislation says that’s what an RA is. And your unit trusts collective investment scheme Is that because the axes it’s that so everything is really underpinned by the laws, you, you should break it down like that. So I think that helped me to understand or grasp things maybe a bit quicker. And it also made me a lot more comfortable with the amount of reading one, Diaz to do so. Yeah, that’s it’s something I can put a lot of people off. So people tell me they want to study law. First thing I asked him Is do you like reading? And it’s a downturn on wax, think think, again, think twice.

Louis van der Merwe
To you like reading acts. It’s funny. I literally got a voice note, maybe two hours ago from an industry colleague that started studying the deceased estate administration diploma and he said, I’m supposed to read 110 pages this week, in Acts. What?

Aron Samuels
Yeah. And I mean, that’s that’s just legislation and and they’re throwing some case law with that as well. Dealing with appeal cases and Concord cases, goes up to 1460 pages. And you have a few of those to read as well. Oh, yeah. It’s quite a bit. It’s demanding. Do people still

Louis van der Merwe
knock on your door and say, hey, please interpret this Act or the change in legislation or the change in the Income Tax Act? Or have you ever moved away from from that

Aron Samuels
in the early years, as if I’m that old, but the years maybe stuck or more fresh out of my studies? But yeah, I think I put people off of that. So that didn’t bother me for legal opinion anymore, because I’m not really as screwed up as I need to be able to give up a valuable opinion. So Jana, people people come to me for different kinds of advice. This is, I would

Louis van der Merwe
say you’ve rebranded. I have I have

Aron Samuels
unintentionally, but successfully rebranded

Louis van der Merwe
before we get into that rebrand. Tell me a bit more about the Cseh Academy. It’s something that pops up, every now and again, we get an email from this isa Academy saying, Hey, would you want to bring in graduates in your business? A lot of practices are skeptical, but what is the experience of someone actually going through that process? What did they help you in terms of the skill set? And also what was that matching with a practice experience for you?

Aron Samuels
Sure. So yeah, I mean, they do some some really good work and militia diversity chapter of Academy them up not worse data, they really do do life changing work. I remember as a graduate, I just finished up my studies I was working part time and returned and it’s that time of the year we like you need to find a job now and me being me I kept very lost track of all the job applications I sent in I had a spreadsheet with that apply to what I did apply, when am I going to follow up? And I probably applied to in excess of 50 jobs. And yeah, new digital yourself, you you feel it right, you have a decent qualification become law, it’s not that that common, you’d think it would be this odd. It’s actually not so the Sisa Academy was one of the only institutions I can say that that gave me a go and they also the running a number of programs in the one that I wasn’t going overseas, the i internship program. And like you said, they partner with some of the bigger management firms LNJ 91. imagery and Carl from from not mistaken or at the time it will last for and desire really, to try to do a lot of work in one while craziness because I mean, your your green, your new teach that you were student tomorrow, you’re you’re an intern. And then they also do a lot of effort in the old matching process. But the I think they do have a challenge was finding practices, who are able to take on able and willing to take on interns, and to do so on a continuous basis, and the practice hours by step two, over the course of three years, I think that took three in terms of Rojava first, but in having a lot of conversation towards the Joshua Lewis goals of the academy at the time as well. They’re always looking for more but this has been a minstrel show. They started off only in Cape Town and during this book, and I think we went 15 in total. And from what I see now they are all over the country. B E Durban bloomers. Well, if I’m not mistaken, so they actually been a much better take up. But from a practice side, it’s difficult because you’re still running a business and the sponsors the asset managers are on board and the Academy help to to carry some of the The financial obligations because I mean, they said would want to buy you a living livable wage or salary. But the way practices are set up is that if you’re paying someone a salary, what value are they adding and asset value? John’s lightened monetary terms.

You can only do so much to charity so to speak. But if you’re paying an intern X amount, that in terms of his CD going out, seeing clients, finding new clients, and apples isn’t the expectation. So it’s tricky from both sides. So Aron, I mean, it sounds like the professional is not yet set up for the structured maybe a little bit ahead of its time, that they help you get work ready. But then that that point of applying to 50 jobs with someone that, you know, now has a degree and has these skills? And what was going through your mind like at that point, did you consider other career options? Do you revisit? Is this what I want to do? Yeah, I mean, you’ll, you’ll wonder, I mean, you you have to keep your your your options open at that stage, because it was the first round of it being that I know, the funding that that Academy was able to subsidize was, the intention was actually only eight months long.

The depth was what they were able to do at the time, from what I understand it’s 12 months now. But I mean, I was in a fortunate position where the practice that I did an internship at the actual wanted to keep me on, and they keep me on for additional year and then force one another, but, but I mean, that could have been different. And for all the good intentions at that stage, we’re able to put you into the job market, which is the mandate. That’s, that’s what the academy is trying to do is get your work ready and get you a job. But I know have come to think about it out of the Cape Town group that I started with us as interns. I’m the only one still in the industry. So yeah, that that in itself. That was a bit of a story as well. So like you said, it’s such really about how it’s packaged. And is the industry. Is the industry ready for? Yeah, maybe the structure should change? I don’t know.

Louis van der Merwe
Why do you think it is that you are the one that stole? Yeah, and the other ones dropped out? Because if I look at my class of people that did CFP, very similar stats, right, 90 plus percent of them chose to lift to leave. And then so what what do you think? What does it take to become a financial planner and set it up? I got those, those values without being boastful.

Aron Samuels
Yeah, as you’re putting me on the spot now. But yeah, I think the one thing you’ve heard from all your oil cases, when you when you ask him about the the stream, the context, now they’ve got into the industry, all of them so they stumbled in or found their way into the industry. And, and it was the same for me. And I think that some of us stumble and find our way into the industry. And once we get in, like cannabis isn’t bad actually like this. For 70, or 80%, they get in and they I will look around in the light. I’m not I’m not going to hang around much longer the so like I said earlier 21 to actually in the thing that you know, But funny enough, you wouldn’t necessarily find that sign trained in law for when accounting or when HR or in medical fields. People who studied at our region genuinely that’s what they know that they want to do. And the most of the time they end up sticking it through. But I do think the fact that they almost want to say that financial planning as a occupation isn’t as well marketed. If I can put it that way, you you really have to get in it before you get to dumps. Whereas with other lines of work and industries, you get a much better sense and idea while looking from the outside. Yeah, I think what would want more likely, a student to someone in high school is much more likely to go up to a doctor or attorney and ask questions. What’s it like being an attorney? What’s it like being a doctor? Why don’t need to look out for? I don’t know how many financial planners experience that I have students who I school learners coming up the Norseman in that foreigner,

Louis van der Merwe
what would we need to change for that to happen because if you think about a chartered accountant, it’s only to get through my articles, and then there’s some light at the end of the tunnel. Yet with financial planning, it feels like the light might be there, but there’s no guarantee you still need to waste the light. Right? Is that a function of the structure of remuneration

Aron Samuels
Yeah, I think the Zadie started burden that we are that we are fighting saw do to correct what to redirect. Yeah, I just think at again, at hand the strong from younger people integrate into financial planning as a career and from a inclined perspective, that though perception accuracy, that opposition around the industry, it’s not for many people it’s not something that aspirational. You don’t find many kids being one day when I’m big on one to do this. Because of the perception and and not only perception, but the reality, many people’s parents, many people’s grandparents or factorable experiences that have really put a damper I think and I mean, people have bad experiences with attorneys and doctors and accountants as well. But yeah, it just seems like a brand around those occupations and industry, maybe we should get better. I think financial planning needs better PR.

Louis van der Merwe
Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, let’s talk about that. Because you have, I think very successfully rebranded yourself and especially the work you do with a wealth coach, as someone that’s approachable that the stalls, contacts and you know, heavy information into something that’s actually that enjoyable. And as a financial planner, I mean, I watch your videos on Instagram and these things. Number one, they’re well made, and then engaging and they exciting. What the How did that start? I tell me about that. And is it successful? Right? Is this a long strategy to attain clients? Or what’s your strategy behind this? Should financial planners listening to this spend more time on social media?

Aron Samuels
She was I’m gonna try and put some feelers out. So just starting to the first part of it, we should power into the Savas coach, story in the following frustration and partly out of our being being at a place, and the line of work itself wasn’t totally aligned with my passions of my values. So I found I found an outlet for it. an outlet we actually now need to get people with no strings attached. Man, that’s that’s really what it was. So when you’re working as a financial advisor, or planner, and your remuneration structures have such a nature, we, you seem to be in a position when you have to sell. And that’s not necessarily aligning with who you are. You you’ll find that different outlets are I think I found a productive outlet, which I which I actually enjoy. So, yeah, it actually started as just a branding exercise as a differentiator. As an advisor, I thought this out of the 1000s of other people who call themselves financial advisors, why should what makes me different? So it was purely, a was basically a logo, and a name and a slightly different way of doing things. And then I realized that the students and actually I was a bit of leaks. So yeah, that’s that’s how I leaned more into it and actually bought out the offering and actually formalized at the booth and really took a deep dive, first, into marketing, into coaching, specifically into social media marketing, and just through all of all of that together. So yeah, I went through three or four months of deep diving into podcasting, who do tick tock just learning and learning deep dive into coaching. Human Side of money, all of that and what came out was, was the wealth coach,

Louis van der Merwe
that is fascinating that you you kind of just brought in information and distilling and distilling and distilling and then said, Okay, what am I going to tackle? How did you filter out those those things, because you know, these 1000s of tactics, very similar to a client coming to you and saying, Hey, use 50 Different things I want to consider, you figure out what’s going to be the most impactful for you and for the wealth cage, part of

Aron Samuels
it is, is trial and error. If you go back into your LinkedIn messages, lowering your score up a bit, you’ll see about a year and a half ago, I sent you a message, asking about a course and telling you that I’m going to start my own podcast. That’s the lesson app, and it probably won’t happen for a while back you and that’s exactly what I did. I spoke to people. And yeah, it was trial and error. At one stage. I thought that was the way to go. But I took some approach and uptake was a lot of things and that’s keeping the end goal in mind and reverse engineering, and then learning from the mistakes of other people. So looking at what I’m looking to achieve, and what’s going to be the most effective way to get me the watch JD going to print to achieve my actual purpose. What’s the best medium to use? And yeah, that’s basically in my case from even within LinkedIn, and an Instagram, Tik Tok comes in a close third. But yeah, it’s a lot of trial and error. And yeah, I think you spoke to Tom recently, and I quite enjoyed that. This is a big push. And I mean, it’s my colleagues as well, I’m constantly going on with him about the need to increase the brand presence and social media presence, that one needs to get to a place where where you live with you realize that this is something that I want to do and need to do. And in deciding on what what medium you’re comfortable with. Some people will be in a nervous suite sitting over here talking to your camera. Others hate writing. So it’s about playing to your strengths. I’m a firm believer that if you’re not a camera person, don’t try to make yourself a camera person. Do not create the dragging down chart to start writing blogs or something. So it’s so it’s Yeah, play play to your strengths. And then keep your in God in mind and then just reverse engineer IF GOD OH MY GOD sound

Louis van der Merwe
engaging. And listening to this is that clients that you work with in your 95? Like, are those the same people following you? Or are you using this to generate new potential clients? Like, what? What does engagement look like?

Aron Samuels
Yeah, so my, my mother, the boss, Coach actually stands basically separate from my nine to five. So I speak again, but comes from my, my own need to speak to a certain audience. The audience I want to speak to isn’t necessarily my nine to five, some target audience. So when the Wasco speaks to our goats speaking to the 25 year old, who’s in the first job, or the 22nd, year overdose in the third year of work, city, two year old just got married 35 year olds having their first child. And that’s really to do with a WASP culture. Speaking to index that too. I wanted to speak to that. That’s why I enjoy speaking to. I mean, I even enjoy speaking to students as well. Now, I often get stopped in to speak to them, which is something I quite enjoy. So yeah, that ready. Again, outlet for my striving need, I have to speak to the younger people.

Louis van der Merwe
I think you mentioned a little bit earlier, that’s not necessarily the ideal target market as a financial planner, and then it kind of doesn’t sit complete with your values. Can we talk about how do we make it an ideal target for someone starting out that could say, Hey, I don’t want to be dealing with a 60 year old that’s retiring and having to make these decisions. I want to deal with people my age that are struggling with things that I’m struggling with, and help them on that journey? Yeah, can we talk a little bit about that? Because I think that there must be a way to, to service them or you’re doing this

Aron Samuels
at that stage, you and your, your you and your client so to most equally struggling? We keep sometimes I now my my manager, when I just started out the he told me that you have gone to admin hours 24 mysteries, something he told me you can’t really be speaking to your friends or peers was that Justice brokers? You so that’s the secret of work out? So yeah, no, I mean, that that’s what it comes down to comes down to feasibility and profitability. How How much can you make, I guess a post answer the question, can you make a living financial planner make a living out of servicing 25 to 35 year olds, while having the best interests at heart? And I think that’s a question we can pose to the to the panel. So if you like the discussion, because I really don’t know, I want to say probably not, I really don’t know. That’s why a lot of financial planners, especially the ones that are a bit more established, tend to look at those who have more considerable acids will have better means because I mean, just just so monetization, generating an income when you’re younger, whatever the injuries are high earners, not not rich it, especially if you’re starting from scratch I mean, if you have 150 working from a base of excess amount of uninterrupted during the time to whatever the case is, in a dinette could be a lot more feasible. But I mean, if you’re if you’re coming from scratch, I don’t know, do you think that will be done?

Louis van der Merwe
So it sounds like this challenge is twofold. The one is the income per client. And then secondly, as you accumulate clients quickly enough, and I’m wondering as these people are probably spending 789 grand a month on a call, right? If you if you think about a high income earner not feeling like they don’t necessarily have accumulated wealth yet, surely, they would be comfortable parting with their money if they can see this value for coaching experience or a monthly retainer. When we listen to the Michael Kitsis and his guests. People are doing like group coaching on this level, and they’re paying a few $100 to help them solve these issues down to haven’t really seen someone consistently do this successful in in South Africa like we give up or are you committed to finding a way to serve as soon as the segment I’m servicing

Aron Samuels
the segment? Me if you fully be able to make a loving offer them that that? That’s the father question. So I can be we can distinguish between financial advice and product offering and coaching and more education quotient offering on the other end. When you consider speaking workshops into into that category as well. I do think it can be done. Young people are willing to pay once they see this value.

Most, a lot of young people who do struggle, the rear asset is struggling and it’s about positioning yourself as someone who’s able to help them solve a problem and out and solve the problem. And I think that’s that’s the trick was was marketing. We client sees Okay, Aron, does this bad? Can you do it for me? He solves this type of problem that can you solve my problem was internet.

People are willing to learn. It’s just about reaching them. And yeah, is the easy enough scale. It’s about reaching them reaching them quick enough. So yeah, I’m ending up with more questions and answers here to be honest, and that’s okay. Aron, I think this is worth worth having the conversation I want to ask you when when people reach out to you with a specific problem. Do they often diagnose the real problem? Or is that just the like little tip of the iceberg? And how do you go about figuring out what what do they actually need help with? Yeah, no, they look most of the time people speak of symptoms, and in our market and make little videos or little posts, whatever, I’m speaking to symptoms as well. But it’s only once you actually start start working with someone and I’m sure you’re able to do lightning that that whole process of outputting the Merkava and getting the client to realize that this is actually just a symptom of of something bigger so you’re sometimes you need to stop the bleeding and you do need to you didn’t do need to pay attention to the to the symptoms. Yeah, as you actually have to. And it’s only once you work the bleeding under control, that’s when you can actually sit down and record conversations that let’s let’s actually take a deep dive into this.

But yeah, when people reach out they’re reaching output symptoms. People’s Money disappearing through the middle of the month is people struggling with with date people knowing that they should be investing and it’s probably the right thing to do but they have no clue how to go about it. So yeah, that’s where the educational bulk comes in. And and in other instances, more of more of coaching Are we really do more of a behavior and a mindset issue that that’s holding people back and I think those are probably my favorite people to work with as to people who will actually have enough money they just don’t know what there’s enough money to go around on paper that totally fine. But you ask too much financial life like an alternative it’s a mess. And it currently is but once you’re able to get through the Mason you’ll see that yeah, that’s that that’s quite rewarding.

Louis van der Merwe
Isn’t that a function of the people that tend to worry about these things are the people that are probably you know, fairly okay. I think about it. The people that we see as the people that have made some provision we don’t see the people that didn’t make provision or so far down the line that you know, they’re actually a that things are bad, you know, we need to stop the bleeding.

Aron Samuels
They are in a lot of instances things are bad, but it’s usually either enough time and or money to, to stop remedy the situation I try to ATM especially think about all the old manuscript concept and the in the money vigil and so yeah, most of the people who do speak to you and I as so add that money vigilance back, it’s never only money vigilant. And what I send and it’s an exercise I do with sports, all the coaching clients, our kids, one of the first things after they fill in their name, they do the manuscript we should name because that that’s really the one of the partners or foundations that I used when when working in a in a coaching Sita put someone because that that really that’s affecting the X ray or the or the CT scan, because because in you know when what you’re working with, and are often see the money vigilance,

and in fairly strong, very strong money worship. Aron, for people that aren’t familiar with this, can you explain a little bit the work of Brad Clontz. And you know, the manuscript is, they also are and explain it in the Nowhere, I usually explain it thinking I’m speaking to people, when I explained it in the context of love languages.

Louis van der Merwe
with a person says that all money decisions make perfect sense. And a big part of my job is understanding what makes it make sense for my client. Why does it make such perfect sense for you? When objectively on paper? It just doesn’t? Aron, I want to add the I think it’s Rick Kaler that always says, Any seemingly illogical decision is perfect sense. Once you know the emotion behind it. So for people listening, you can Google k, m Sr, which is the client manuscript inventory. questionnaire. How do you use that? Aren’t you physically? Do you send them a PDF and say, Hey, complete this, you send them a data points link? Like, whoa, like, how do you how do you do this in practice? Have you built your own quiz? She’s had so many to get to that point of boredom my own. But now I actually would be inclined to link and we would say in red, obviously completed and then and now in our coloring session, we’d actually have to be no muscles, so you shouldn’t just just working through that. And yeah, it’s it’s quite, quite eye opening for for the client. And it obviously gives me a much better insight into doing deals, because usually that would be the first actual session after the introductory chat back with him. So yeah, that really gives me a much better idea of who’s of who’s sitting across from me. It might be interesting for you to know that data points has teamed up with the quantities and so you can actually have a custom branded, you know, inventory along with a lot of other financial therapy tools Is it is quite pricey for the South African market. But if

This is a field that you spend a lot of time on unpacking someone’s behavior. It is probably helpful. Do people expect this from a session because I had a client today that said to me, Oh, this feels like therapy like, this is not what I signed up for. And it was quite an interesting conversation to, to talk about, you know, the process is therapeutic, but we’re not attempting to be therapy therapists, clear.

Aron Samuels
So I have in some of my initial documents or send a coaching client, one of the points in the document is that coaching relationship is not a secret relationship. I’m a cultural note therapist, and let’s just get in the fine print it. And, you know, after three or four sessions of working with, with the young lady, she actually had a bit of an emotional moment and just said to me, I can see why you see the seasons, you can feel like it’s, it’s so interlinked and interwoven emotions and money. And that, sometimes we’re talking about money, but we’re also not talking about money, Bashi talking about your relationship with your mother. And now your mother is in an unhappy relationship, because she’s financially dependent on on a significant other. And as a young lady, she might be found herself in a similar situation where she feels that she can’t leave a relationship. And she doesn’t quite understand why. And she’s triggered by by a mother’s experience and what she sees a mother going through, for example. So there’ll be money gone, and doesn’t exist in isolation. So it’s sort of neatly wrapped. She was neatly just, yeah, there’s there’s a lot of overflow, but obviously,

Louis van der Merwe
that overflow needs to be contained as well. Because growth, yeah, once you stick within your your area of expertise, yeah. So Aron, you are also you know, you’re 95, as you call it, a financial planner, financial advisor at Woodlands wealth, how much of these tools flow into what you do? Or is there a more of a strict structure around the work that you’re doing there? Yeah. So so the work that I do at Woodland, yeah, obviously, methods and our own processes, ways of doing things.

It’s the manuscripts and still human beings at the end of the day. It’s not luck when as you accumulate more about you kind of become less than human and become more rational. I think it might actually be the opposite. I think as as people were some people accumulate more than become placeless, rational. So yeah, there’s more things to worry about. Right? There’s more things going. There’s more things at stake. And I think maybe also, that is why dealing with slightly older clients, slightly more complex makes sense for a lot of advisors, because the stakes are much higher. Like you said earlier that you have time, and you have money, and you have time to fix things. But for someone in their 70s someone in their 80s Maybe they don’t have the luxury of time. So how would you position this work with someone that’s of a different generation of someone that’s maybe not used to talking about the feelings around money, like you know, in a conversation where you can clearly see a your manuscripts or derailing your financial plan? What would Aron do? Like what are the things that you look out for and what are the type of questions that you might pose to those clients? You know, I had listened to a podcast a few months ago.

Aron Samuels
And most of the podcast, I’ve listened to Tom about the human side of money and And the dolls scene was around the house of the helper. And I took that a bit further in that the reason why a lot of financial planners are use it and to speak about the softer stuff is because they haven’t figured it out for themselves personally. So these might be a perception that when all financial planners financial appraisal perfectly in order because you know what I only do it for client all day every day unless it was solid and and that’s all that I sought to reality. I spoke to a legal professional few weeks ago Aspen’s legal professional as a BA and respected, they’ve got two children that aren’t ever Whoa, can’t make assumptions. So yeah, sometimes we spend a lot of time on focusing on others and and we can neglect ourselves. So I think the conversation is solved with financial planners in South and either need to go on that journey individually or they need to speak to someone but I think as a beginning point to someone listening to the sins but but they’re praying. So I think is the beginning point, do them through the manuscript. wishing they yourself and ever look at the results. Yeah, it really gives you some better insight into yourself. And then once you’re more comfortable with looking at yourself in that context, then you might be more open to speaking to clients more about about the human side and what’s actually driving the decision making. I mean, we portfolio matrix as a as a great financial personality assessment that that partially speaks to towards one’s behavior, and which is a good starting point. But by toasting that is only the starting point. One of my colleagues mentioned here earlier today about just adding value to review discussions, especially if your client has been with you for 710 or 15 years. You can only go through the through the statements in taxes every year. And then both of you are Broadwater will walk over the House to talk about and and this is the type of conversation one one can have. Yeah, and it really does add value and the client walks out to that review meeting, what are the nine what’s the return was for the year but maybe learn something more about themselves as well. And then in what’s more valuable than that?

Louis van der Merwe
Isn’t that so true? I mean, I just read a book, from strength to strength and the summary of it was essentially that we should be spending more time on getting to know ourselves and our own strengths and if we can facilitate that, as financial planners, I’d be the first to acknowledge that my finances are far from perfect and you don’t have to have your finances perfect to be able to help someone else just like you have doctors that also get ill you have financial planners that struggle with these same things and I think it’d be still human right and acknowledging that and saying as a human I can show up and I can help guide you through this process if I’m healthy like you said that health of the helper what what do you seeing from financial planners? What What’s the number one thing that they’re struggling with at the moment?

Aron Samuels
Sure. I think one one that comes to mind is probably something that will always be being struck in this what what does the future look like in terms of clients in terms of practice and and out all fits together there’s there’s more and more news and movement around younger people immigrating our people are people leaving or that leaving and not coming back or they’re coming back and I really think that it’s a concern JD depends on on where your practice is in its life and and who that practice services but I think regardless of the segment of the market speaking to look after the these these different challenges and one that that will always be the regardless of the segment you’re in is the synth noise sets out the hour My treat people actually be listening to Yeah, I think sometimes you wish we can put noise cancelling headphones until the next meeting with us and they can take a look and listen to us. But but that’s not the reality. Your clients or in all kinds of WhatsApp groups before the lower the lookout for this look out for that. Blind to seeing banks in the US folding this, there’s a lot of noise and it’s difficult keeping clients focused on the controllables. And what’s actually relevant to the waster Rand going? Is on just outside again, how long are they gonna spy desire? last conversation seven on the bribe, but keep some people up at night. And then that’s not useful at all. So yeah, easier said than done. But I think the biggest challenge is keeping clients focused on the things that actually matter and the things that’s actually going to make a difference, whether the rent goes to 14 or 23 or to whatever. How much of that can you control

is your asset allocation is in line with where you need to go with adjustment need be by proxy sticks, of course, simple as that. Aron,

Louis van der Merwe
way of simplifying and like saying, you know, the home was blatantly obvious, and I love it that you have a way of gently nudging people. And for people that want to learn a little bit more of the work that you do, where can they find you? What’s the best way to connect with you?

Aron Samuels
Best way would would be LinkedIn, or ensembles around with one eye. And then about Coach everywhere else on Instagram, the walls coach detox a wealth coach essential is a massive Tiktok audience with machista I feel my nancial planners beyond LinkedIn Instagram and and Tiktok because we will see me almost every day and yeah, always happy to to chat and engage in the AMA learner. So always looking, looking for learning opportunities.

Louis van der Merwe
Thank you so much for the content and the wisdom that you’ve brought today. All the best with continuing this marathon because it it really is. Yeah, we’re just getting started.

Aron Samuels
Thank you so much. Great chatting.